Posted by: Blackiswhite, Imperial Consigliere | September 26, 2009

An Honest Discussion, Continued…

I think the real starting point is here:

“I am interested to hear why it is you scoff at the notion that the Constitution is Christian document….”

HP @ 537

 1) Admits that the Constitution incorporates Christian values; and

2) Derives some of its principals from Christian thinking.

Could he elaborate and provide examples?

And then later he says that the Constitution “is derived from Christian values, but also consistent with the values of other religions.”

I’m having some trouble grokking the point you are trying to make here, HP…

Are you implying that some of these Christian values could have been derived from other religions at the time the instrument was authored, or is that an after-the-fact observation by which you imply that because some of these as of yet unidentified Christian values are consistent with those of other religions, and because the document itself made no reference to the values it contained being Christian in origin, they were not intended to be or could not have been Christian?

I’m not trying to be a smartass; it is hard to know how to analyze some of the things you have said without knowing what values you identify as Christian and why.

Alfie @545

I think it might be helpful to the clarity of the discussion to make a distinction between the “Founders/Founding Fathers” and “Framers [of the Constitution]”, because while some of the same people belong to both groups, many more do not.

Founders may most aptly describe the men who signed the Declaration of Independence or who played a prominent role in the Revolutionary War.

Framers would be the men who attended the Constitutional Convention.

Only six of the signers of the Declaration of Independence attended the Constitutional Convention…you could also argue that Washington, and  Hamilton could be included in the dual grouping because of their prominent service during the war.

Having said that, I think the ‘deist’ tag for the Founders and Framers is wildly inaccurate, and I invite you and Gorilla to define for us what you mean when you use the term.

Posted by: Blackiswhite, Imperial Consigliere | May 8, 2009

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